Author Topic: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"  (Read 1646 times)

Offline ViKtoricus

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Why? How come with all the advancements that we have had in science, we still can't CLEARLY explain why certain types of training programs work? Why can't we explain the effectiveness of high-frequency squats?

This is something that has been bothering me for months. I want to know the science behind why us weightlifters are such a phenomenal bunch.

And I know we can explain things like "Ohh!! We have the best speed-strength!" or "Ohh! We have lots of fast-twitch muscle fibers, etc." But what I want to really know is why can't science just provide us a concrete formula of training numbers? Only some few russian translated texts have done this successfully, and sadly, here in the U.S., there is so much misinformation that the truth often gets buried.

I just want the truth, and explanations as to why our type of training yields this certain type of result.

Why????????
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Offline Chris Ⓐ LeRoux

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #1 on: Jul 16, 2011, 06:51 AM »
The social sciences are infected with the idea that human beings can be studied as if they are atoms, neutrons, protons, etc, when in fact human will and choice make this utterly impossible.
"Show me the government that does not infringe upon anyone's rights, and I will no longer call myself an anarchist." ~Jacob Halbrooks

Offline Arturo Gómez

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #2 on: Jul 16, 2011, 01:15 PM »
"why can't science just provide us a concrete formula of training numbers? "
Because that formula doesn´t exists.
If exists, it has more variables than experimental units you may use, so, is imposible verificate a global model (as in economy).
Happily, we have posibility of access a solutions in sport medicine, in biomechanical analysis, in experimental design, in control of process. We can process data with we can communicate and acces to the information with much more facilities than in the past.
Science and technology give us a lot of important tools to study and control good training.

Offline Andy Dick

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #3 on: Jul 16, 2011, 01:30 PM »
I agree alot of what is said.  I add this: it was once said "to create an Olympian you need 3 factors: genetics, heart, and work ethic to get there.  When all these factors work together you get an Olympian."  As Chris said will and choice play a major factor as well especially in our society with the freedoms we have.  It is easy to find those that have the mentioned 3 when every kid is put in a sports school to find it.  But here there are more options that this kid who has the potential to be an Olympian in WL may go into football instead because he enjoys it more or there is more to be gained from succeeding in it.  It is also hard to test because they are not the "norm" population.

Working with a lot of high school athletes you see this a lot.  You have the kids that dont care with no talent, they usually do not do sports.  The kids with little talent but a ton of heart and work ethic, this kids will give it thier all and may see succees but will most likely not achieve super star status (team sports change the example a lot because it is not always dependent on the performance of 1 sole individual). The kids with talent (or talent and heart) but no work ethic and they may be successful for a time but will not achieve top super star status because they wont put the work in to get there.  Then you find the kids that have the loved 3, the kid always doing what it takes to get better and able to handle anything you throw at them.  The potential for greatness is already there it is simple factor of the kid growing into it and getting thier body to that level.  (PS that is also why some garbage trainers reach fame because with these kids they are already good and the trainer's poor programs may cause some success but usually once the kid gets good quality training they flourish, but since the trainer trained the kid starting out they will name drop the kid as helping the kid achieve until the trainers dieing day, and th lay person will believe it and throw more kids at the trainer).

Offline Matt Erdman

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #4 on: Jul 16, 2011, 08:02 PM »
A formula isn't really needed. With time you can figure out all the basic forms of improving strength and speed-strength. You then find the ones you respond to best. Then you emphasize those without  entirely excluding the others. The last step is to set your volume and frequency to produce the best rate of progress.
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Offline ViKtoricus

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #5 on: Jul 16, 2011, 11:41 PM »
A formula isn't really needed. With time you can figure out all the basic forms of improving strength and speed-strength. You then find the ones you respond to best. Then you emphasize those without  entirely excluding the others. The last step is to set your volume and frequency to produce the best rate of progress.

Aren't certain things universal?

I understand that there is such a thing as individuality but...
"Get others to do the work for you, but always take the credit."   -Robert Greene

Offline Chris Ⓐ LeRoux

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #6 on: Jul 17, 2011, 06:44 AM »
Human beings aren't and will never be standardized or universal. In order to create a "formula" for the "best" training program, science would have to be able to account for all the psychological factors in every detail, for starters. This is impossible. Science could amass so much study of the issue that they could, in theory but not practice, establish the "most effective average program" which could then be applied to, for example, Naim Suleymanoglu and very possibly wreck his career.
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Offline Matt Erdman

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Re: I really just don't get it......... What is the "secret?"
« Reply #7 on: Jul 17, 2011, 01:52 PM »

Aren't certain things universal?

I understand that there is such a thing as individuality but...

Isn't that what I said? You start with the factors that will typically cause strength increases for most lifters (the universal part), then you see which ones have the greatest training effect for you (the individual part) and emphasize those in your training.
I haven't spoken to my wife in years. I didn't want to interrupt her. - Rodney Dangerfield