Topic: Bulgarian strength way

[ado gruzza]

Technical question:

Do you think we could say that lifters that are in a close bulgarian style training are weaker in strenght lifts (back and front squats) copared to a same level sn + cl & J lifters trained in a Russian/ Medvedyev way?

I know is a generalized and very teorical question, but i always thought that, even in powerlifting, bulgarian training would be the final step. But, till today, no one try, or can create something structured, in that way.

In powerlifting teory training we are very late, we came out of bodybuilding only when some russian coach start to train powerlifting east european team (Sheiko was assistent coach of Prilepin and medvedyev).
Now after discovering the russian way, could be discover the bulgarian way?

[Dave Almeida]

I would say the Bulgarians would exceed most of the Russians in squats (gym lifts) during both of their primes but it is simply speculation as no one really knows what the Russians squatted back then. People may claim this or that but you would really need to ask the individual in a very specific manner as to what their best max single in the squat was. A Russian may simply reply "I never went to a max single in the squat because I could squat for reps enough to clean and jerk a world record so why bother".

For example, at the Arnold I asked Marc Huster what his best front squat was since everybody seems to think that he could clean what he front squatted. He said his best FS was 225kg for a triple and he felt that this wasn't very much compared to other 85kg lifters and that he relied on his technique more. Maybe somebody once asked him... "what do you front squat?" and he said "what i clean and jerk" because he mostly trains with weights around his best CJ in training and not thinking that they wanted to know a true max.

I honestly doubt very much that Zacharevitch cleaned more than his best FS. I do not doubt that he cleaned more than what he normally trained the FS with in training. Kolecki is another example... They say his 232.5kg clean and jerk was 2.5kg under his max FS. Well that is certainly untrue as his best clean and jerk in training was 240kg (just check his website). When dealing with squat numbers you really need to get it straight from the horses mouth and be specific when asking the question especially when the individual may come from a different country, speak another language primarily, and train under a different system with less of an emphasis on maximal squatting strength.

I don't know what the Bulgarians pull but I did see a video recently of Plamen Boev doing a relatively easy 280kg clean deadlift as an 85kg lifter in training in Bulgaria.

There may be some merit to training max singles often in non-equipped powerlifting but I think it will need to be done at a less frequent rate than in weightlifting (not 6-8x a day like real Bulgarian weightlifting) because the lifts are slower, overloaded more and tax the CNS more each time. To my knowledge the Russians do quite well in powerlifting so while I understand trying to stay ahead of the curve, they may have already figured most of it out.

[Chris Betancourt]

It depends what the athlete responds to. Me and my friend did a program written by Medvedyev for beginner lifters. At the end of it, my friend had hit PR's in squats and the classic lifts. I only PR'd in squats. So my friend swears by Medvedyev's programs now.

I have all my training sessions written down so I can go back to them, see when I hit a PR, and look back 2-3 weeks before hitting the PR to notice trends. The trends are all the same; I only hit PR's after training with very high frequency (5-7 days/wk) and lifting near max (>90%) at least once a week. I would say it's closest to the Chinese system.

[Philip Middleton]

To answer the very first question in your post, I would put money on russians being stronger in the strength lifts (not just limited to back and front squat). Not due to any ignorant "Russian power" type ideologies, just from what I understand of their different training styles. However if your talking only back and front squat, I would suggest there front squats would be relatively the same, however back squats would fall in the Russians hands.

[ado gruzza]

To answer the very first question in your post, I would put money on russians being stronger in the strength lifts (not just limited to back and front squat). Not due to any ignorant "Russian power" type ideologies, just from what I understand of their different training styles. However if your talking only back and front squat, I would suggest there front squats would be relatively the same, however back squats would fall in the Russians hands.

I got the same idea, just for a more metabolic work they do.
Thanks for the smarts replies.

[ryankyle]

Dave,
     Where did you see the video of Plamen Boev and the 280kg deadlift?

All,
     You have to remember that when you see Bulgarians doing pulls and other exercises you need to put it into context the time period of when they were lifting.  When Abadjiev (1968-1989, 1997-2000) was they did not like pulls in the later periods, mid-80's and during his second term, however when he first started they did but he gradually tossed useless exercises.  When Rusev was the coach they did pulls.  When Asparakov (2001-2004) was coach he said they would do some pulls but only with 100% and also jerk from rack and powers.  It sounded like when Terzinski was coach (2005-early 2007) they never trained (relatively speaking).  Now Borislav Gidikov is the coach and I'm no sure how the training is but I will find out.  However, I can guarantee you the heart of the program is still heavy and a good portion of the work is on the lifts themselves, it's the other stuff that has changed.

Ryan

[ado gruzza]

Thanks for the overview.

By the way, once i find a similar "overview" on Last 50 years russian coach, where the autor explain (very generlically) how do they train. Could someone tell where I can find this web page I conuldnt find anymore?

[Dave Almeida]

Dave,
     Where did you see the video of Plamen Boev and the 280kg deadlift?

A warning: if you have any previous experience with Bulgarian internet you will understand that these websites load SLOW.

Пламен Боев - 280

That is the 280 pull.. Looks more like a deadlift now that I watch it again.

Plamen Boev - 180

That is an easy 180cj in training.


I haven't checked around lately, maybe there are more of their national lifters that have been uploaded recently. There are some pretty nice squats done by their lifters if you take the time to look but it is probably not worth it unless you understand the text which will make it easier to search.