Topic: Bulgarian Style Training

[Chris Ⓐ LeRoux]

I will just throw out a couple thoughts stirred up from reading Matt Foreman and Scott Safe's messages. I see Steve Gough's point about the doping issue in that we have limited ability to affect any change on the international scene. So, the question remains as to what do we do? Well, I guess we do everything we can do, on the drug front, of course, but also we have to do everything we can do on the training front as well. Are we the best that we can be?

Can drugs be an excuse that hampers one's ability to achieve their full potential? Yes. Is the present situation fair? No. But, we still have to do all that we can do-on the doping front, but also in preparing our athletes in a way that befits a champion. Because it is about the battle, not the victory. Victory is glorious, but there is no victory without the battle and there is no victory without defeat. No one achieves their best result without hope. The drug problem in our sport is a detriment to hope because those who choose to remain clean face daunting obstacles for "success." So, the doping problem must be addressed. I would agree with those that say the current downpour of positives in our sport does in a sense mean that some effort and progress is being made. But, I think we all know there is much more work to be done, without even opening the discussion on gene doping.

But, I also think it is too easy for the doping side of the problem to dominate our minds and discussions. I believe Wes Barnett accomplished the "impossible" because he refused to accept the "truth" and simply stretched himself to the breaking point. True, he seized a once in a lifetime opportunity, but that is what I think we need to talk about. When these opportunities present themselves, when results are down slightly because of a new doping test, we must be ready to step up and achieve PRs to win medals, to achieve, to strive and attain.

We can do better than we are doing. Anyone that doesn't accept that, in my opinion, doesn't have the heart of a weightlifter. Will it be good enough? Who cares? I don't. I believe there is value in discussing the Bulgarian approach. I adapted to huge workloads under Dragomir, much of the program influenced by Bulgarian methods, and I saw my fellow teammates prosper under these giant workloads as well. Did it work best for all of us? No, but what does?

Steve, are you hearing me? Is anyone? Let's step up and break some American Records. Then lets talk about the doping, and we better not fail the lifters that step up and produce those records in the battle for drug testing either. Is the Bulgarian method "correct"? Could it be "correct" for some and not others? Is that what is important? No, I think what is important is hope. Sorry if this seems over the top.....just writing from the heart.

[Scott Safe]

Hi Chris;

I love your passion.  That is the key in all things, not just weightlifting.  I, too, believe the drug issue is a crutch for many American lifters.  They are focused on why they can't win instead of working on being the best they can be, whatever that is.  I would like to see a "meeting of the minds" so to speak, of the top American lifters, as Matt referred to.  Let's  look at each training method and record it, for all USA coaches to see and use.  One athlete may respond very well to one type of training, and others may respond better to another form of training.  I just don't think we know what's best yet, especially in a drug free environment.  I think the Bulgarian system makes alot of sense, but I'm not so sure it's a year around program.  But, I'm not sure it's not the way to go year around either.  I'm sure most all of you know of athletes that have been on steroids.  Ask them how different the training and recovery is.  The massive muscle gains in literally weeks.  If the programs we are studying and following are using steroids as part of the program, can we expect to have the same results when we don't use?  Recovery is nowhere near the same.  So, how long should our recovery be?  Depends on the athlete, I suppose.  I think Mike B said there is no such thing as overtraining, just under recovery.  Anyway, the information from America's best would at least be a starting point for us coaches to build upon.  I would really like to see some in depth training info from these top lifters, and coaches, for that matter.  I'd like to hear more about what Gayle Hatch does, also.  
Just my two cents.

[Matt Foreman]

I agree, Scott.  I haven't heard much over the years about how Hatch trains his lifters.  But his method is obviously proven, so it would be nice to check out some programs.  I know the resident program at the OTC has changed several times over the years, so it's fair to say that different methods have produced high results out there.  Also, Jim Schmitz produced some pretty consistent results with his Sports Palace team in the 70s and 80s and I know they only trained three days a week (according to what I've read).  Seems like there are many ways to skin a cat, and many of them work.

Using a Bulgarian approach, aside from the question marks about recovery and durability, would require a pretty specific system that allowed the lifter to train full-time with few outside distractions.  And this type of environment is a tough one to pull off in this country because of funding.

[Karoliina Lundahl]

I'll give this a stab. I have lots to say but I'll try to be curt.

I tried the Bulgarian approach for nine months (without drugs). We had about half a dozen female lifters in Finland between the ages 16-40 years training this way. The reality was that no-one produced any big results but most of the lifters had serious recovery issues. These included loss of sleep, weight loss, pain in muscles (I couldn't go into a squat with bodyweight without pain), high stress levels (elevated hormone levels) and nagging injuries. I was about to quit the training regimen after three months but decided to stick with it since I was told so many good things about it - it's all about ADAPTATION and it didn't seem my body had adapted in three months, it needed more time. I can honestly say now that after nine months I was not any closer to ADAPTATION than I was after the first workout.

My background in weight training started as a track & field athlete, I was introduced to olympic style weightlifting when I was 16 in 1984. I have trained under various training regimens from Bulgarian singles to long sets (snatch: reps of 14, 12, 10, 12, 14 for a workout) and everything in between. For those who don't know me my best snatch in 75kg class is 105kg, cl-j 127.5kg (at 77kg 107.5+130). The results I achieved under the Bulgarian regimen were snatch 92.5kg, cl-j 120kg in the first two months and at the end I had problems snatching 90kg and cleaning 110kg, jerking 120kg (best jerk 150kg from boxes). Many blamed my age (34 then) for the lack of success but the same thing happened with our 16 and 20 year old lifters.

Although those nine months resultwise were a fiasco I gained valuable information from them. That was one of the reasons I wanted to attack the regimen - and of course the promise of big PRs! I wanted the 112.5kg snatch and 135kg cl-j!!!

The good things I learned from the Bulgarian regimen:

1) Rest between exercises. Take 30min (at least 20min) between your hard exercises. Lay on the floor, zone out, REST. The workout lasts long but it does raise the quality of the next exercise.

2) Try to increase the load of the next set. Instead of doing a simple three to five sets on a given weight (say triples or doubles), try to increase each set. Instead of going (this is only a general example, I'm just playing with numbers) 3x70%, 3x80%, 3x3x85%, try 3x70%, 3x80%, 3x82.5%, 3x85%, 3x87.5%. With the 1kg increments this can be done easily by adding a kilo to the next set. (NB! This does not apply to specific workouts when one is working on technique etc.)

3) If you are doing pulls in your training, 9% of all your lifts (legs, lifts, pulls) can be snatch pulls, 11% clean pulls. The strength from clean pulls transfer better into the clean than snatch pulls into snatches.

4) Learn to take as little warm-ups as possible before hitting competition weights. Warm-up for competition with singles, get up to 90%+ lifts quickly. You'll appreciate it in your last competition cl-j.

I prefer the pre-Sulemanoglu Bulgarian regimen from the first half of the 70's. It also stresses the importance of heavy singles but does not exclude higher reps (up to 5's) and many important accessory exercises for the overall health of the body. Keeping your body healthy so you can train is an important factor in determining if a training regimen is any good.

[steve timmons]

Hi
First of all, excuse me for my bad english, i hope you understand what i'm saying.
Im'not a weightlifter, i'm a powerlifter but i like east training methods (soviet and bulgarian). I normally use the Sheiko's method (russian powerlifting coach), but i'm enchanted for bulgarian.
The last post of karoliina is very interesting, but i got some questions:
1) you tried the "full" bulgarian (6 days per week, 2/3 workout per day)?
2) what are the problem of this system? MTR (maximun training weight) every workout with alot of attempts? Frequency too much elevated?

For example, the squat: what is the sustainable frequency of MTR attempts for a drug free lifters? 1 time a day but every days? 3 times per week?

Thanks, i hope you could help me to better understand the PRACTICABILITY of this method

[Karoliina Lundahl]

Answers to your questions:

1) I trained 8 times a week. 2 workouts on MON/WED/FRI and once on TUE/SAT. Here is a typical MON/WED/FRI workout day (I did some triples and doubles also, not only singles the whole time):

AM workout:

Snatch: 2x50%, 1x60%, 1x70%, 1x75%, 1x80%.
30min rest.
Clean-jerk: 1-1x50%, 1-1x60%, 1-1x70%, 1-1x75%, 1-1x80%.
30min rest.
Squat: 3x60%, 3x70%, 3x75%, 3x80%.

PM workout:

Snatch: 2x50%, 2x60%, 2x70%, 1x80%, 1x85%, 1x90%, 1x95%, 1-2x98-100%, 1x90%, 1x95%, 1-2x98-100%.
30min rest.
Cl-j: 1-1x50%, 1-1x60%, 1-1x70%, 1-1x80%, 1-1x87%, 1-1x93%, 1-1x98%, 1-1x100%, 1-1x90%, 1-1x95%, 1-2x1-1x98-100%.
30min rest.
Front squat: (triple max) 3x50%, 3x65%, 3x73%, 3x80%, 3x87%, 3x93%.

If energy left, one can repeat snatch and cl-j quickly to max after squats (take 30min rest in between).

2) The problem with this system? HAHAHAHAH!!! Had I figured that one out it would had worked for me!!! I feel like it shot my whole nervous system down - performing a squatting movement with only bodyweight was painful. I lost all my explosiveness (jerk max dropped 30kg!!!) and I had never in my life been so weak! I also had nagging injuries which I could not get rid of (shoulder, glute). Many athletes on this program (male and female) started to have back pain and soon abdominal work and back exercises were added to program (I did them the whole time so I was spared back pains). I know that in Sofia, Bulgaria, they have a place to do ab and back work at the Academy gym. I have personally seen someone use it.

I believe that a person's capability to handle max lifts is personal. Also note that a max lift for a female lifter is harder than for a male athlete because of the mental energy they tap into: females tend to be able to hit higher percentages in am training than men. This means it also wears down on them more than on men and recovery is longer.

My personal capability (=no drugs) of hitting maxes was following. This is when I was in good shape and produced my heaviest lifts. It is also most likely the main reason why the Bulgarian single regimen did not work for me:

Snatch: once a week.
Cl-j: once in 10 days (I had a weak clean, all my cleans were heavy).
Squat/front squat: 2 max workouts per 14 days 10 days apart, then followed by a resting week with no squats over 80%.

[steve timmons]

My personal capability (=no drugs) of hitting maxes was following. This is when I was in good shape and produced my heaviest lifts. It is also most likely the main reason why the Bulgarian single regimen did not work for me:

Snatch: once a week.
Cl-j: once in 10 days (I had a weak clean, all my cleans were heavy).
Squat/front squat: 2 max workouts per 14 days 10 days apart, then followed by a resting week with no squats over 80%.

wow, thanks karoliina for your answer, very kind and exhaustive.
It seems you now apply the soviet method: frequent but NOT MAXIMAL maximal workloads. It's similar with the Sheiko's method for powerlifting, where one use average loads of 80/85% and a lot of sets (5/6) of 2/3 reps. To prevent burnout of the central nervous system.
But....so.....this bulgarian system is only for superhuman/drugged lifters?  :cry:  :?  Or with some adjustments is applicable by us - poor deadly men-?

[Scott Safe]

Wow....Thanks for the info, Karolina.  This is really valuable.  Honest talk about what has worked for top lifters.  John Kuc, the great powerlifter, said in an article in Powerlifting USA magazine that when he went drug free, he had to reduce the amount of heavy squats to once a week and deadlifts to once every 14 days.  He still lifted incredibly heavy weights, but quite a change to his training to get there.  Your training looks a bit like what John came up with for powerlifting.